In this interview, conducted with His Eminence on April 13, 2009, the esteemed religious authority Sayyed Muhammad Hussein Fadlallah (ra) responds to questions from students of the Arab Institute. He speaks about his formative years in Najaf, where he was shaped by a rich scholarly and cultural environment, and about his engagement with Lebanese affairs. He also addresses questions concerning the relationship between religion and politics, presenting his vision on Islamic unity and citizenship, and ultimately discussing the role of women in society...
Below is the full text of the interview:
The Influence of Environment on Formation
Q: What influence did your family environment and your southern Lebanese roots have on your upbringing and your inclination toward religious studies?
A: I come from a Lebanese family originating in the south, from the town of Ainatha in the Bint Jbeil district—a family with a scholarly tradition. My father and my forefathers were religious scholars who held deep standing in jurisprudence and religion within their communities.
I was born in Najaf, Iraq, because my father remained there for thirty years. Najaf is the center of Shiite religious learning—the seminary where Shiite scholars from across the world pursue their studies in jurisprudence and philosophy. My father was also among the teachers of this seminary and was himself a jurist of the highest rank (mujtahid).
It was only natural that this environment—both the broader scholarly world and my own household—left its mark on my aspirations. I began my studies at the religious seminary at an early age, when I was just twelve years old.
At the same time, Najaf was also a literary and cultural hub, a place where one breathed poetry and literature. So my starting point was that Iraqi-Najafi environment, which produced many great poets—Muhammad Mahdi al-Jawahiri, Muhammad Sa'id al-Habubi, Sheikh Ali al-Sharqi, and others.
My family, the Fadlallah family, was also a poetic family. So I began composing poetry at the age of ten—by the time I was twelve, I had already written a poem about Palestine in 1947, in which I said:
Defend our usurped right,
In Palestine, with the edge of swords,
Remember Saladin's day,
When he rose to expel the foreigner.
I participated early on in Najaf's literary clubs and celebrations, reciting my poetry there. So alongside my jurisprudential studies, I was also active in the cultural and literary movement—because even at that time, I was open to the contemporary world. I read Egyptian cultural magazines like The Egyptian Writer by Taha Hussein, publications by Adel al-Ghadban, and The Message by Ahmad Hasan al-Zayat. I also followed the poetic movements in Egypt, Lebanon, and Iraq.
Thus, I grew up in Najaf within the seminary but with a contemporary sensibility—I was not traditional in the narrow sense. And from an Islamic perspective, I was also a unity-minded person. I recall that my first visit to Lebanon was in 1952, and on that occasion I recited a poem commemorating the fortieth day of the late Sayyed Muhsin al-Amin, in which I called for Islamic unity—and I remain to this day a proponent of Islamic unity.
So this mixture of religious, scholarly, cultural, and Islamic influences—all within a contemporary horizon—contributed to the building of my character. And that character has continued to develop through lived experience, because I believe that when a person is an Islamic advocate and bears Islamic responsibility, he must look upon the entire Islamic world—across all its political, cultural, social, and security dimensions. For Islam, in this regard, opens itself to the whole world.
The Land of Knowledge and Scholars
Q: Why was Jabal Amil, and why does it remain, a homeland for scholars of religion, literature, poetry, and public culture?
A: The Jabal Amil region was the area that proved its authenticity and its scholarly, jurisprudential, and literary presence. Therefore, the specialization of religious scholars in Jabal Amil was spread across more than one of its villages, and there were religious schools in many towns—in Bint Jbeil, Hanawayh, Ainatha, and others.
Great scholars graduated from these schools, and they traveled to other Islamic lands—some went to Egypt, others to Iran and Iraq—to study under their scholars. The scholarly movement in Jabal Amil was able to produce major scholars who left a profound influence in Iran, such as Sheikh Bahai, Sheikh al-Hurr al-Amili, and Muhaqqiq al-Karaki, among others. They also traveled to Iraq for specialization, and the Najaf seminary has produced great scholars in both the past and the present.
Religious Sciences and Worldly Sciences
Q: Is it possible to harmonize religious sciences and worldly sciences?
A: I do not believe that knowledge exists within narrow confines. Religion, in its extensions, represents a culture open to faith, to sacred law, and to Islamic concepts of life. The Noble Quran affirms the value of knowledge and reason as both an Islamic and human value, as Allah, the Most Exalted says: "Say, 'Are those who know equal to those who do not know?' Only they will remember [who are] people of understanding." Az-Zumar (39:09)
The Quran also emphasizes that a person should not limit themselves to a certain level of knowledge, but should ascend from one degree to another, as Allah, the Most Exalted says: "Say, 'My Lord, increase me in knowledge.'" Ta-Ha (20:114).
A person must continually seek more knowledge whenever they step into any position. We know that one cannot comprehend the greatness of Allah, the Most Exalted except through understanding the greatness and mysteries of creation—and this opens one to all the secrets of life, all the issues of reality, and all the concerns of humanity, which in turn opens one to the scientific realities of the world.
For this reason, Islam encourages the human being to embrace religious sciences just as they embrace the sciences of life, given the responsibility of the Muslim toward all of life. And one cannot fulfill this responsibility unless they are cultured in all its dimensions and particulars.
Religion and Politics
Q: Why are religious scholars criticized for interfering in politics?
A: Politics is religion, and religion is politics. We read in the Noble Quran: "We have already sent Our messengers with clear evidences and sent down with them the Scripture and the balance that the people may maintain [their affairs] in justice." Al-Hadid (57:25).
Thus, the foundation of all divine messages throughout the entire movement of the prophets is the establishment of justice among people. When we want to establish justice among people, can justice exist without politics? The justice of the ruler with the people, the justice of the people with one another, the justice of the law...?
Politics is represented by these titles because politics, in its human authenticity, represents the means through which the management of people's affairs, the raising of their standard, the preservation of their system of life, the preservation of their relations with one another, the preservation of their freedoms, and also the adoption of the causes of might, dignity, and the like are intended. This cannot be achieved without politics.
As for the politics of playing on ropes [opportunism/duplicity], this is not politics; this is devilry. Therefore, we say: politics in the human sense is in the depth of religion, but politics in the satanic sense is far from religion. Anyone who adopts the politics that cheats people, deceives them, and exploits their naivety and needs is adopting satanic politics, and its practitioner is a devil.
The Problem of Sectarianism in Lebanon
Q: How can harmony be achieved in Lebanon between politics and religious and sectarian diversity?
A: The problem of Lebanon is that it has no religion; rather, it is sectarian, and sectarianism is tribalism. There is the Muslim tribe, the Christian tribe, the Sunni tribe, the Shia tribe, the Maronite tribe, the Catholic tribe, and so on... Indeed, some Muslims or Christians might be atheists, but they exploit Islam or Christianity as a banner, just as some exploit Shiasm as a banner, and Sunnism as a banner as well, and the same goes for Catholicism, Protestantism, and Orthodoxy.
I used to say that sectarianism is an inflated drum, beaten by sectarian individuals to gather people around it, when the drums of sects and the drums of denominations that stir up fanaticism in this field are beaten.
Some people say that the problem of Lebanon is religion, and I say that the problem of Lebanon is irreligion, because—regrettably—there are some sheikhs and some priests who move through their ambitions and through their dependency on politicians, not through spiritual, moral, and religious values.
Therefore, we say that we must transition Lebanon from the sectarian system to the system of citizenship, because the sectarian system is the secret of Lebanon's problems and the secret of the interference of others in it. I have even said that the sectarian system, which made every sect independent in its regions, in its men of religion, and in its men of politics and economics, has turned Lebanon into "un-united states." Hence, we call for citizenship, in the sense that the Lebanese takes his rights as a citizen and bears his responsibility as a citizen.
The Role of Women in Politics
Q: Why are women not given their right to participate in political work, as long as there are women who head states, and assume ministries and high positions in politics, science, administration, and defense?
A: We have issued a fatwa that a woman has the right to have all roles, whether political, cultural, educational, social, economic, and even security roles in certain cases. Motherhood represents a vital role for a woman, just as fatherhood represents a vital role for a man; however, just as a man is not limited in his role to fatherhood, likewise a woman is not limited in her role to motherhood. A woman has the right to participate in all activities imposed by the homeland or imposed by the nation upon the people who move for the sake of building their personality and building their life upon a strong, stable, free, mighty, and dignified foundation.
Unity and Overcoming Differences
Q: Social interaction between Sunnis and Shias has increased over the past half-century, making these two sectarian blocs a single social bloc in marriages, neighborhood coexistence, work, political thought, and economy. Nevertheless, we did not feel this political rift in the past as we feel it now; what is the reason?
A: When we speak about Lebanon, we find that there are certain political leaderships trying to benefit from provoking sectarianism within the Islamic sphere, in order to stir up people's sectarian fanaticism so that people gather around this one or that one, on the grounds that he is the one defending the Sunnis or defending the Shias in this matter. This leads to creating a blind sectarian fanaticism in which the Shia deems it permissible to harm the Sunni, and the Sunni deems it permissible to harm the Shia.
In the year 1985, I delivered a lecture at the Makassed Islamic Alumni Association entitled: "Islamic Unity between Reality and the Ideal." I mentioned therein that among the means that could contribute to alleviating the tension between the two schools of thought is the spread of mixed marriages between Sunnis and Shias. This is because when a person becomes a son-in-law to a family from the other school of thought, they draw closer to its reality and become acquainted with the truth of its life and its details. Consequently, they discover by themselves the falsehood of many lies and stereotypes promoted about this sect or that one, and they no longer believe them, because they become a part of this environment and know its truth through direct, firsthand field knowledge. I believe that Lebanon is distinguished by the fact that mixed intermarriages between Sunnis and Shias have reached an extent that makes them represent a remarkable Islamic phenomenon in this field.
The problem is the political fanaticism that attempts to turn sectarianism into a political approach. For this reason, we find, for example, that some Shias abuse the Companions, and some Sunnis declare the Shias to be non-believers... Thus, these issues are stirred up during religious occasions in this community or that community, because our problem is that we live in the past and do not live in the present, while Allah, the Most Exalted says: "That is a nation which has passed on. It will have [the consequence of] what it earned, and you will have what you have earned. And you will not be asked about what they used to do." Al-Baqarah (2:134)
They had their obligations and responsibilities for which they are accountable before Allah, the Most Exalted, and you must have your responsibilities; they made victory, so make your victory, and they made defeat, so overcome your defeat in this field.
So the problem is that we live in the past, and we try to transfer its disputes into the present reality and the future.
This is from one aspect; from another aspect, international arrogance, foremost of which is America and Europe, along with certain ruling regimes in the Arab and Islamic countries, are trying to stir up Sunni and Shia fanaticism under the banner of "divide and rule." This is in order to prevent the Arab world and the Islamic world from remaining stable, but rather to keep them governed by the disputes of the past, so that they forget the challenges of the present and the future.
Women's Freedom
Q: Your Eminence has voiced renewed positions for the liberation of the human being, particularly women. We feel that you possess the social, juristic, and moral conviction that enables you to launch more advanced positions regarding women's freedom?
A: We define freedom by what makes a woman a human being, such that her humanity elevates to the point where her mind becomes great, her heart is open to goodness, and her energy is open to justice and to what enriches the human being in life. This is because a woman has two personalities: the personality of the human being, and the personality of the female. Therefore, we want the woman to move forward as a human being who has a mind that thinks, a heart that beats with goodness, and an energy that moves for the sake of raising the standard of society. As for the personality of the female, it is a personality within a specific sphere—within the sphere of marital life, or within the sphere of private women's societies.
As for the role of the female in mixed society, you know that society looks at the woman as a body, and does not look at her as a mind. Hence, the hijab in Islam is not a detraction from the woman's dignity, but rather a kind of respect for her, so that she moves in society without being an element of provocation, desire, and the like, as you know it even at the university level, and even at the general levels in this field. Similarly, a man has two personalities: the personality of the human being in which his mind, heart, and energies open up, and the personality of the male, which is a private personality in marital life. As for the personality of the human being, it is general for all of life.
Therefore, we emphasize that the woman is a human being like the man; her mind is like his mind, and her energies are like his energies—indeed, she may even surpass him in her energies when she moves them for the sake of science.
For this reason, we believe in the freedom of the woman, but within moral frameworks, just as we believe in the freedom of the man within moral frameworks. Morality is not a tax imposed on the woman; rather, it is open to both the woman and the man, because it is for the entire human being, and spiritual and moral values are values meant to establish the human authenticity of the human being.
Source: An interview conducted by the students at the Arab Institute with His Eminence on April 13, 2009 AD